A mountaineer standing at the pinnacle of a mountain can look down and see all the paths he
could have taken to secure the zenith, and from his lofty perspective is capable
of mapping these routes.
Can the same be achieved by a person somewhere en route or is this a recipe for endlessly
exploring many dead ends?
Is it even possible to attain "Yoga" whilst deviating from the ancient, clear and precise practices of each of the paths to
Yoga?
Is "Modern Yoga Practice" a path to "Yoga"?
Replies
Please try to get your own experience that is more valuable than books, off course our holy books are base through which you can take reference and do Sadhana as advised by your Sadgurudev. So keep going on your path you set for but without true guidance of a Sadguru it will be difficult to get right direction.
Wish you all the best.
Kriyananda Maharshi Dayananda
thus, I thank you for your highly valued comments!
My humble soul walks the earth since about 40 years, using the light of the "almighty Jagatgurudev" as guidance and we are "working on it" to improve it for everyone, cause:
"Truth is a pathless land, Man cannot come to it through any organization, through any creed, through any dogma, priest or ritual, not through any philosophical knowledge or psychological technique. He has to find it through the mirror of relationship, through the understanding of the contents of his own mind, through observation and not through intellectual analysis or introspective dissection!"
- Jiddu Krishnamurti -
....there is something that keeps convincing like an echo from the depths of the universe, like an ever repeating Mantra...
- hari om tat sat -
The word Brahmacharya does any way force to say to be away from sexual intercourse. Does it mean that? No and Not at all as I understand. The very first we should understand that Brahmacharya stands for what and why it said for. It is meant for totally conduct and those who behave and make all deeds accordingly like a Brahma comes under brahmacharya actually.
So, where the sexual intercourse is said? We should understand that Yoga Path is totally a Sadhana Path and Brahmacharya also comes under a rules set by our sages to be in and follow to attain the target set for. So to know the Brahma you should be abstinence according to Yama and Niyama that are for DO and Don’t DO which help a aspirant to pace ahead firmly in to his Sadhana without any obstacle. It is just like, if you obey the system and its rule while climbing on a mountain you will get success and if not or negligence in obeying the guidelines provided may then occurs some accident or unsuccessful to reach on the top.
If the Brahmacharya really meaning only free from sexual desires and thoughts then for your kind information that all legend Sages, Maharshi were married and had their family and even our Gods are married and having family so where the Brahmacharya is broken. Did they not maintain the Brahmacharya?
Yes, while remaining in Sadhana one should be conducting as per the guideline of sadhana to get the Siddhi (perfection) but those who have gotten the state of Brahma or become a Brahma Scholar and if they do such intercourse the then it does not affect them nor they even feel for a deep attachment in such lustful deeds. They do all karma in a SackchiBao but do not keep affection.
The main thing is that sexual intercourse is a physical part where as remaining in Brahmacharya or follow as Brahma is a function from chaitanya soul and Manna which do not follow the Physical (Sthul Deha) command but these sthul deha or Sarir function according to the command given by the soul and Manna. So Sexual intercourse comes under Dehachari or Sarirchari but not Brahmachari. This intercourse is a physical demand but not a soul and Mann demand so those who works with the help of body could be call a Sarirchari or Dehachari and hence there is no question of remaining or performing as Brahmachari or free from sexual desires and thoughts.
Actually spiritual functions performs through being in Pranmay Kosha but not from Annmaya kosh so those who perform through Annmaya kosh are dehachari/Sarirchari and those who perform through Pranmay Kosha are yogi actually and behave like a Brahmachari.
So the rules designed by our legend sages are for their disciples and to all common people as well in order to establish a good society with keeping a good moral and social value to have a nice development of culture and ritual accordingly and spiritual knowledge as well through which divine powers could be received also so that they can enjoy the life cpmpletely.
Kriyananda Maharshi Dayanada
Dear valued Kriyananda Maharshi Dayanada,
thank you for deeper clarification on this very subject, the topic is clear so far, it's not exceptionally about (Sex) which basically is just one very physical thing of many other so called "distractions", which may carry the burden of attachment with it, yes, that has never been a question.
But...
The aim was to point out that Brahmacharya is often mistaken for just celebacy and thus sort of enforced, in the believe this might be it already, nothing will happen, but there is a good chance that this enforced celebacy will overflow the force installed floodgates and find it's way, one or the other, to get it's course - after all it's one of the strongest major natural forces (look around!) Not freely entertained celebacy of all the sense objects is like trying to use a wild bull for ploughing.
This is not easely enforced as fines for infringing traffice laws, neither reached by simply setting and following rules as in (trying to) "observing Brahmachri"
Yes, in fact it means celebacy of the mind from ALL attachment, desire and so on, but say at the "Beginners level" for the "laymen", as there, in real life, not in monastic or ashramite life, are families, wifes, children, jobs, "worldly responabilities" - Life itself and yes all part of the annamaykosha, physical attachment dependance, sexual attraction of the senses, but the koshas are not to be taken as completely divided from each other, after all, all these empirical emanations are ALL part of the grand play, like there is no house without foundation or pillars, one cannot exist without the other - it's ALL entertwined, like various fibers of an intricate fabric.
To expect the laymen, the "Yoga-Practitioner" of today to understand the entire concept of Brahmachari, is rather far fetched and can not expected from the laymen to be able to manage a strict following as much as, say an initiated Sanyassin or Yogin/i under the guiding light of his/her Guruji,living in the confines of an Ashram or even a caves.
With effort, practice will grow, like a child and will take more depth, withit desire will melt and craving for sexual desires too, as it is by it's nature a physical, very short "peak" experience, which carries many, many, sometimes very painful traps with it, however the more the Sadhaka (here only in the context of "practitioner)" disolves into practice, the more he kindles (maybe even unknowingly) the fire, the divine flame through sadhana, pranayama, asana, dharana, observance of Yama and Niyama, this all will intensify through practice and be nourishing the sacred flame, getting deeper into the subject of practice, the closer the practitioner will come to the realization of Atman which represents the deepest light that shines through the koshas, and takes on their colorings, these koshas are merely boundaries, no strict barricades, all the various forms of Yoga, as Hatha, Raja, Bhakti, Jajna, Kriya (and so on) together, they guide one directly through the layers (Koshas) of our being to the direct experience of the center of consciousness. Meditation, contemplation, mantra and prayer finally converge into a unified force directed towards the final stage, piercing the pearl of wisdom called bindu, leading to the Absolute.
As Sri Krshna let the Gita explain that he is the Mantra, the Yoga and will turn towards anyone as the guiding light who will turn towards him....(Chapter9/Vers16-19,22,29). it's HIM, that which can't be named and can't be cornered, nor harnessed, or kept, but worshipped....
Jesus said in the Bible: "He who turns towards me one step, I will turn towards him 10 steps...!" The same is claimed about "Allah", the almighty of muslim faith.
And very, very important verse 30 of chapter nine - forgiveness
Certainly, it is through this experience, understanding will arise and with it abstinence from desire in general will occur naturally, because "the jar" get's slowly, slowly filled with amrit of knowledge, therefrom understanding will arise, from here a deeper, much wider gathering of knowledge about the subject will occur and this sword will chop all shortcommings into the kindling that the eternal flame will consume, and through this process keep the flame alive wich in turn illuminates the dark realms of avidya - or Ignorance, non-knowledge - one needs the other.
However, personally I entertain the concept of the very essential core of the truth and there is a deep running suspicion that there are many rules, born out of along history of traditions, rituals, frozen over time, in time, designed by men to adhere to - for the sake of it... not neccessarily with the aim of liberation at first hand!
Besides, over the hundreds or 1000's of years and of laws, advice, orders, "do this, do that" has it really become a "better world", a better society ordoesitstill, depends on every single individual how he/she may be willing to transcend his/her "worldly affections and attachments"?
Maybe, as in many other fields, some things need an urgent review and some well conducted trial test runs.....
"O Bhagavan, kindly let me know the secret of health now."
Dhanvantari replied: "This seminal energy is verily the Atman. The secret of health lies in preservation of this vital force. He who wastes this vital and precious energy cannot have physical, mental, moral and spiritual development."
there are many people today who dare to challenge this statement, scientifical this does not any water, as a generation 100 years ago used to think veru much the same about sexual activities, even that masturbation makes insane.... !
And I really don't know how to discuss this matter, as it seems to be one of the orthodox, rather strange laws on the path to enlightenment, I would ask the massive temples and the money wasted on these structures before daring to question sexuality which brought us and the whole animated kingdom here in the first place - therefore full orthodox Bramhacharya carries the seal of over zealousness!
Observerance, awareness, full consciousness.... is the key!
" Allencompassing Attention is the Flame which consumes the ancestral residues that define man as an egoist and fearful being. With this Attention, the unity of our being is inherently accomplished, and an unlimited energy suddenly becomes available to us.
Transforming action can only take place in the alive and active present, never in the future. If we are not always in the present moment, we miss Life’s true meaning. The obsolete past and the imaginary future, which obstruct reality through the drifting mind, will always veil the Truth.
When lucid Attention is our constant companion, we light the path of our Life and, through this light, all the residues which degrade us morally and spiritually are dissipated. It also offers us the moral capacity to not commit other errors.
Therefore, our whole work consists of watching and listening each wandering thought, each movement of thinking, each desire, each fear as they attract us into the thicket of time. This perfect encounter makes all these disappear, and in the “psychological emptiness” which ensues spontaneously, we have a pure Consciousness integrated into Boundlessness. "
In this state, we find Love without cause and boundless Happiness, which, through their nature, embellish everything happening to us, good or bad, beautiful or ugly, pleasant or unpleasant, or even extremely painful.
"
Fear
Our path on this Earth has ups and downs,
Sometimes the road is barricaded, by all kinds of
challenges;
Sometimes, at a crossroads in our life, there are no signs.
Here comes the question, beloved travel companion:
Where to go? Which is the right direction?
We do not know! There are many hazards and the path is
dark!
We don’t have intuition and the courage is lacking!
But we cannot stop – Life itself rushes us!
Once, someone told us that within us is hidden,
All the recorded knowing of Life on Earth,
If we knew how to access it, there would be no problems,
The wise solution would dissolve any dilemma.
Any man has access to this vast library,
For the key is within us, as well as in every human being,
There is one condition: to banish all fear,
Right now, in this moment, without delay.
Fear is an emotional state, closely connected to the “ego”,
This fiction a bizarre construction,
Fearful by nature, in all its endeavours,
Which create its structure and its frail universe."
- Ilie-Cioara-The-Silence-of-the-Mind -
Satya -- Truthfulness
Asteya -- Non-stealing
Brahmacarya -- Sexual responsibility
Aparigraha -- Abstention from greed
Dear MK
I am not agreed with the terms you used for Brahmacharya, Could yo please elaborate it more clearly so that people could understand correctly.
God Bless you.
Kriyananda Maharshi Dayananda
if you don't agree with this term, I haven't coined it as such,
it is but a more recent interpretation of Brahmacharya.
Why don't you offer the forum YOUR view of "Brahmacharya"?
Here a interpretation from revered Swami Shivananda:
"Brahmacharya is absolute freedom from sexual thoughts and desires. It is the vow of celibacy. It is control of all the senses in thought, word and deed.
Brahmacharya is not mere bachelorhood. There should be strict abstinence not merely from sexual intercourse but also from auto-erotic manifestations, from masturbation, from homosexual acts and from all perverse sexual practices. It must further involve a permanent abstention from indulgence in erotic imagination and voluptuous reverie."
and the great Sri Shankaracharya said:
"Brahmacharya or spotless chastity is the best of all penances; a celibate of such spotless chastity is not a human being, but a god indeed... To the celibate who conserves the semen with great efforts, what is there unattainable in this world ? By the power of the composure of the semen, one will become just like Myself."
- Sri Sankaracharya -
Which is today, by many considered orthodox! Many argue that living in absolute celebacy in it's striktes sense, doesn't replace "lust" and desire, desire might be the source to attain Brahmanhood through askesis and self punishment, people may find satisfaction in abstaining sexual activity, may even regard themselves higher, cleaner then their counterparts, which in turn feeds the ego... there are traps everywhere!
When Kundalini has risen, the target has been met, the nine gates of the great city, will be under control, through the very fulfillment, if one hasn't tasted Soma, has no understanding of Bindu and Ojas, of the Bija and the Jiva, of Atman and Para-atman, if someone has never tasted Gulab Jamon, how will one be able to explain the taste or a blind person the breath taking view of sunrise in the Himalayas?
There are people who argue that if sexual conduct, leading a family life, as well as food and many other things in life are sacrificed to the lord, and not taken for selfish reason are free of bondage, then the way is the way!
Some thinkers, think that an strict orthodox interpretation may cause more an obstacle and a hurdle, for
example married and/or unmarried couples..
The more one advances on the path, the more all the "universal rules" will come and place and stay there,
it has nothing to do with self punishment, it's all about self awareness and self observance -
how to make a hungry stomach feel full and happy?
How would have Jesus appeared to the hungry?
Not everyone living in this world has given the vow of being a sanyassin and wearing saffron robes or chosen to live a life of a hermit.
Next is the great question if all this self punishment,renunciation, lead to anything spiritual valuable or maybe enhance the ego of the unwary!?
Lord Krshna doesn't say so in the Geeta, so has the Buddha, Neem Karori Baba has said that being for 20 odd years in the confinement of a cave was "nonsense"... he was a great siddha!
it's a big issue, the great "divide" in the protestant and catholic church, in the one priest may very well marry and have children, in the latter it's regarded "sinful", why did god give to the universe these "tools of prakriti"?
How can a priest advise married couples about children and having children if he has no experience himself?
I know this is a very sore point in this field.... in my opinion it's one of the most abused as well as most beautiful things in the material world i.e. the universe - Linga-Yoni, Shiva-Shakti, Rama-Sita, Shiva-Parvati, Vshnu-Lakshmi is the spiritual side of this "coin"!
if one approaches the realm of deepened spirituality the "urge", "desire" will burn in the fire fire of wisdom attained on the path towards enlightenment and self realization!
Relax, watch ones thoughts, the breath, and practice full awareness, consciousness, being aware in the here and now, not getting lost in laws, restrictions, traditions, rules and other bondage's, which tie the spirit down!
Anyone is welcome to agree, to dis-agree!
- hari om - ram, ram, ram, jai ram -
Namstasje!
It is a personal view, my favorite one -not necessarily the truth- that Masters and Traditions play the hard part when one has no contact with a certain level of the Inner Real; being the goal pursued to put him/her in contact with this Light. But when this contact is done, the external program is made not unuseful but a 'subsidiary'.
It is important to take into account that frecuently, a Yoga Path (Subject + Program) is one of the vehicles of Maya, for the Avidya sake. It is Yoguis are caught by illusions of such a sort and such a level that it is easier for a non-yogi to free himself of the own than a 'yogui'. For example, the theme of siddhis, the temptations for the gifts, the belief of being an Enlightened Soul, a Master, a living Krishna, and so on and so for.
Yoga can be practised within a Yoghic Framework or a Para-Yoghic, Protoyoghic or Non-Yoghic Framework. (I think, for instance, of mediums who practice Yoga in order to channelize better the spirits' messages) By the means of study, intensive practice and the correct attitude and guide we can get a very good idea of the Yoghic Framework. But the Yoghic Framework, that which links Ashtanga, Jnana, Bhakti and Karma with the different branches, to the Himalayan Summit of the Being, in a specific way for the specific individual, is a confidential teaching of the Inner Light.
Even an otherwise mundane activity could be a Yoguic Act or a Yoguic Discipline if according to the lines of the Director of the practitioner's Yoghic stepping. This, one more time, my personal belief. Best wishes in the YOGA path!
"A Burning Flame
What are you doing now? Where are you in the present
moment?
Are you moving? Stop, be still!
Are you preoccupied with an idea? Are you playing its
game?
Or, in utter apathy, you are absent to the present reality?
Here are a few questions we ask every day, persistently!
In order to encounter Life in its perpetual movement,
Always newness, never repeating itself,
We start from “now” – the eternal, independent,
Free from “yesterday” or “tomorrow” – a constant act of
living.
The man, free from the past, clear, lucid and watchful,
Moves the same as Life, always in the present,
Like a flame that burns ceaselessly,
Renewing itself continuously, through constant watching."
from: Ilie-Cioara-The-Silence-of-the-Mind
as well as refer to the Karika of Gaupada, Shankara's teachers teacher.
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